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| Moderated by: truthseeker, bil4913 | Page:   1 2 |
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| Where does your freedom come from? | Rate Topic |
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| Posted: Fri Oct 10th, 2008 03:45 pm |
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21st Post |
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TimM Member
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WV and CB, Thank you both for moving and eloquent personal testimonies. I don't have much to add either to what you say or to what I've said before. Much of what you've said I've experienced in my own life or seen friends experience. There remain at least 3 areas where our experiences or language differ: (1) I'm certainly not at a place where I could have done the job of sorting through porn for 2 days. That's a task I'd have to decline and let someone else do. Might that change in the future? I don't know. (2) I'm pretty philosophically committed to the notion that right now I can live correctly right now, and that right now I can't live correctly tomorrow. I'm therefore much more reluctant than you folks to assert that future sin is now impossible for me. I'm much more sympathetic to the attitude of the desert fathers. There's a story of the death of one of these saints (Abba Arsenius, maybe? I don't recall for sure) in which, as he was dying, the devil appeared before him and said, "You have conquered me." The saint's response was, "Still, I am not sure." That attitude of humility about the future and of continuing moment-by-moment dependence on God has deep experiential roots for me as well as philosophical and theological meaning. I don't see myself ever moving past that position. (3) I'm only willing to talk about my own experience. I know what has worked for me, and what has not worked for me. That's all I know. I can't see inside the souls of others. I'm therefore much more reluctant than you folks to make global claims about how others can or cannot find freedom. Again, I don't see myself giving up that methodological humility. I respect what you guys are achieving in your lives, but in asking us to make definitive statements about either our own future or the souls of others, you're pointing to a path I can't follow. Best regards, though. May you be peaceful and free. Tim M.
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| Posted: Fri Oct 10th, 2008 09:59 pm |
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22nd Post |
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Man Member
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CB wrote: I totally agree, Ed. And I want to unpack your point just a little further. If we look at verse 31 and 32 together, we can catch the cause and effect, so to speak, of knowing the truth and what I believe that truth actually is.Maybe I am not understanding, but for me this is very abstract. I don't get it... What do you do if you i.e. have cancer and don't get healed? Do you have to give it EVEN MORE to Jesus? How to do that? For me this is a little bit nonunderstanding: How do you let Jesus heal? And to those who mean that you are set free: How did you do it? Last edited on Fri Oct 10th, 2008 10:04 pm by Man ____________________ May the Lord bless you all! |
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| Posted: Fri Oct 10th, 2008 10:14 pm |
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23rd Post |
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Man Member
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Ed Neal wrote: CB,How long did you struggle with this? Exactly how and why were you set free? That might be interesting to know. Maybe there is another way for me, but maybe I can learn something from how you experienced it? There might be different ways for different persons allthough Jesus might be the only one who saves? Maybe He does ways with different persons? Be blessed Thanks
____________________ May the Lord bless you all! |
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| Posted: Sat Oct 11th, 2008 01:47 am |
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24th Post |
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Ed Neal Member 
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Man wrote: How long did you struggle with this? Man, I struggled for over 30 years, even while in full-time ministry. I'm not sure that the way I was set free is the way everyone is set free, but I am sure of this... bondage is the fruit of living as if a lie is true. Freedom comes by living as if the truth is true. This is true for all, because it is exactly what Jesus said. The truth that I came to that caused me to be free may not be the same truth that sets others free, like those who have testified here. But I know it works, because for me, it's been over 2 years now... so completely different than the previous 30 that I cannot adequately describe the difference. Pastor Ed
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| Posted: Sat Oct 11th, 2008 05:17 pm |
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25th Post |
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Man Member
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Ed Neal wrote: Man wrote:I don't get it. What is truth? What do you mean? Is it theoretically, practically, mentally?How long did you struggle with this?
____________________ May the Lord bless you all! |
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| Posted: Sat Oct 11th, 2008 06:06 pm |
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26th Post |
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Ed Neal Member
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Man wrote:I don't get it. What is truth? What do you mean? Is it theoretically, practically, mentally? Jesus said, "You will know the truth, and the truth will make you free." If you are experiencing bondage in regards to how you respond to the human body (yours or someone else's), then you must believe a lie about the human body. If you can discover what that lie is, then reject it (no longer live your life as if it were actually true), your interested in porn will go away. As "simple" as that. It happened for me so surprisingly that I did not realize at first that it had actually happened. I thought it was just a temporary waning of interest in porn. Now, over two years later, I know for sure that it was real and permanent. The hard part is in determining what the lie is that you are believing. The funny thing about it is that the lie is something that right now you simply take for granted as being true. You have to be willing to reexamine everything. I can't know what it is for you or anyone else for sure. Several men here have professed very different lies that they uncovered in their own hearts than it was for me. Yet they affirm the truth of Jesus' words in their own experience of being truly set free. My friend, this principle and promise spoken by Jesus is, in reality, the key to our growth as followers in Christ. The better we understand the truth about who Christ is, the more we will become like Him. This is why John told us in 1 John 3:2 (NIV), "But we know that when he appears, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is." In one of CB's posts in this thread, we were reminded that true followers of Jesus were marked by "holding to My [Jesus'] teaching." Again, I would suggest that "holding" is much more than credal affirmation, but "believing and living by" Jesus' teaching (the whole counsel of God's Word). This is why Paul told us that in order to no longer "be conformed to this world," we must "...be transformed by the renewing of your mind..." (Rom. 12:2) The mind is the seat of our beliefs, and it controls our actions. If we truly change what we believe (and our actions as a result), it will transform our lives. This is why we are told that "Surely You [God] desire truth in the inner parts" (Ps. 51:6 NIV). This was written by David when he was expressing his repentance for his sexual sin with Bathsheba. The solution to our sexual bondage is not in strategies, but in truth. Wrestle with God and ask Him to reveal to you what lie it is that is keeping you bound, then reject that lie, no matter the cost... and freedom will be yours. It is as "simple" -- and as difficult -- as that. Pastor Ed
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| Posted: Sun Oct 12th, 2008 07:42 pm |
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27th Post |
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Guitarist_John Member 
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It is as "simple" -- and as difficult -- as that. I can't believe it... but I can... I do... YOU'RE RIGHT!!! Everything makes sense now! Faith, belief, truth it all makes sense now!!! I AM FREE!!! This is incredible. What you said is true! For so so long I believed a lie, and that lie was that I would never be free. I all I have to do is believe in what Jesus said. Jesus is the way! Now I understand that passage, Romans 12:2 makes sense! We are "transformed by the renewing of our mind", we shouldn't "conform to any pattern of this world". The world will tell you that you aren't set free by believing; that you have to do something. No! That is not the truth! The truth is that I am I've known the passage that "whom the Son sets free is free indeed" and that "the truth will make you free"... the truth is that whom the Son sets free is free indeed! I believe the son set me free! Whenever I thought about that, all these lies came up saying, "No, you aren't free. Tomorrow you're gonna be the same. Nothing is going to change" or something like that. But thats a lie!! The truth is that Jesus set me free! Enough said! I dont believe that anymore! I believe I am free! I'm not sure that the way I was set free is the way everyone is set free, but I am sure of this... bondage is the fruit of living as if a lie is true. Freedom comes by living as if the truth is true. This is true for all, because it is exactly what Jesus said. The truth that I came to that caused me to be free may not be the same truth that sets others free, like those who have testified here. This is...so incredible! Its true! I am not bound to masturbation or any sexual thing anymore! Man, you've been seeking so many answers and asking so many questions, but this is all that you need to do! Don't listen to any more lies! Just believe that you are free! The lies will come and tell you that you aren't free, but you have to say "No, Jesus said I am free and I am free!" You just have to push away the lies. They will tell you "this freedom won't last you, won't be any different". Don't believe them! I understand now...true believers truly are brainwashed. The way true believers think simply goes against the world. The only way to receive this new nature is to believe what Jesus said and did and to MAKE it truth in your mind. Just push the lies away and speak the truth. Dig into the word and see the truth for yourself. I now also understand the passage James chapter 1... 22Do not merely listen to the word, and so deceive yourselves. Do what it says. 23Anyone who listens to the word but does not do what it says is like a man who looks at his face in a mirror 24and, after looking at himself, goes away and immediately forgets what he looks like. 25But the man who looks intently into the perfect law that gives freedom, and continues to do this, not forgetting what he has heard, but doing it—he will be blessed in what he does. My mom told me that the reason James used the mirror analogy is because what God says in His Word IS a mirror... what it says about how we are the righteousness of Christ and we are set free and that he has given us new natures, that is US! We have to believe it, and we become it! I'll tell you all how I came to the realisation that truth sets you free... This morning, when I woke up, I was mulling and thinking about my whole situation with lust: it seemed like there was always was something big and heavy looming over me. Well, I was thinking about all this, and I, foolishly, put through my mind all those fantasies that I had indulged in, and I thought to myself something along lines "see all this? There is no point." and merely running those through my mind sparked lust and I began indulging and I actually began masturbating, but conviction came over me and I just stopped. I repented and moved on. Later, in the afternoon, right before we went to church, I read what you, Pastor Ed said and I was pretty much shocked: I was going to write "are you serious?" and some more but I decided I could take care of it later. After church I asked mom about why people who are Christians don't get complete freedom from the old self that was crucified on the cross and taken away. She told me because they don't believe it. She helped opened my eyes to the truth that the truth sets you free and the truth is that he whom the Son sets free is free indeed. Theres alot more to the story, but its late and I need to get to bed. This thing hit me so hard. It was such a revelation. I am because I believe! I am free from lust because I believe that Jesus died on the cross and set me free from the old nature and therefore I believe I am not bound to lust anymore! Now I will take up my cross and follow him. I can only say what Pastor Ed has already said. Just believe! God bless, new John  Sorry if I overwhelmed you with my repetitiveness!
____________________ "In the world you will have trouble, but I leave you my peace that where I am there you may also be." - Jesus |
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| Posted: Sun Oct 12th, 2008 09:41 pm |
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28th Post |
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Man Member
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Guitarist John, I am happy if you have experienced some positive things in here, and what will you do with it?
____________________ May the Lord bless you all! |
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| Posted: Mon Oct 13th, 2008 02:30 am |
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29th Post |
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CB Member
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Guitarist John, Dude, I am sooooo happy for you..... It is so exciting to see somebody 'get it'. Seriously, I read through your post twice, and was almost in tears. You completely made my night. God is great. CB!
____________________ cbthinking.blogspot.com |
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| Posted: Mon Oct 13th, 2008 10:32 am |
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30th Post |
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Guitarist_John Member
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CB wrote:Dude, I am sooooo happy for you..... It is so exciting to see somebody 'get it'. Seriously, I read through your post twice, and was almost in tears. You completely made my night. God is great. God is great! I was actually crying last night from happiness and relief, and this morning, I actually shed a few more tears of joy. Mom was actually surprised that I didn't know about this sooner, and she reminded me of how people live their life and die not knowing that the truth would've set them free. She remembers, way back, when she was a young believer, that she didn't quite feel free. She didn't have any addictions or anything, she just didn't quite feel free. Then she read the scriptures about renewing your mind and about how believers are the righteousness of God and so she spoke it out and believe it and she became it. When we were discussing all this, she used a great illustration: she told me to count, in my head, to ten. Right when I was about to start counting, she suddenly asked me "What's your name?" And I said "John." And she said, "What happened to the counting?" "I didn't think about it." And she said that, that was because when I spoke, I forgot what was going on in my head. She used that as an example that we should speak out the truth when our mind is full of lies, and we should focus on what we speak. And she reminded me of the verse in Proverbs that tells us that "death and life is in the power of the tongue; and those who love to use it reap the consequences". When the lies come and tell me that I'm not really free, that I'm not gonna last a month, I speak and tell them the truth. Whats the point of believing a lie when you know the truth? She also told me that as life goes on, the new life that is, it gets easier and easier to live with this new mindset. Well, its like I'm in a different realm or something. I just, feel different than I used to. I know what it means to believe now. Guitarist John, I am happy if you have experienced some positive things in here, and what will you do with it? What will I do with it? Well I'm going to hold on to the truth, that is Jesus, the solid rock, that He set me free. I'll turn back the lies that had me bound, and I will vanquish them with this truth. I'm also gonna hold on to this truth with other areas of my life too, not just lust. I'm gonna be a servant of God and I will share His love as hard as I can, and carry the cross, and carry the Gospel. It seems like the least I could do for Him.
____________________ "In the world you will have trouble, but I leave you my peace that where I am there you may also be." - Jesus |
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| Posted: Sat Jan 31st, 2009 04:40 am |
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31st Post |
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solar7light Member
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Anyone here believe in the "Freedom stuck" or "Stuck freedom" theory or experienced it first hand? A theory When you reach a point where freedom is there, but you are bound to a chain of utter and complete misery once you opt to catapault yourself back into the carnal caverns. this misery is heartache and internal mental suffering and anguish of a such magnitude that you have no other option. other than to stop. sorta forced into a obligatory freedom act written/signed alongside powerlesness. "not really rock-bottom.....but a variable exists in your life that inevitably hinders/crushes/collides." Could be considered the genuine "hand of god" with corrective procedures.
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| Posted: Mon Jul 11th, 2011 12:05 am |
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32nd Post |
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mike w Member 
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Very well said. As a matter of fact this is something that I was thinking about recently. True freedom. So many times we seem to worry so much about not falling that it is as if we are not really free. True freedom means you can not fail. This is freedom that can only come through Jesus Christ. Here is what I call freedom. I have had several nights over the last month where I have been totally alone. Wife at work and kids out of town. I did not give in to temptation,the truth is, the longer I have gone the less temptation there is. I am not saying this out of pride,as a matter of fact I take no credit for this change. I know that it is Christ Jesus that set me free. If anyone has doubts then start by truly repenting,ask Christ to help you to overcome and you will. The longer you go,the more you get beyond the temptation without giving, in the easier it gets. I understand how hard it is when you first truly start the road to recovery,but eventually it will become second nature.
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